After a 13 year marriage my narcissistic ex confessed to an affair throughout. I found out after many years that my father had these traits, and I dated several men over the years very much like him. I felt like I had every DSM diagnosis there is in the months immediately after his leaving, the other woman, and what seemed like torturous behavior (he turned really mean)! This is all past tense and yet in my head it feels like yesterday. He says they are not having sex. This can be extremely frustrating and took me a long time to learn how to deal with and I want to share what I have learned about dealing with this today. Well see how long that will last. I think however there are differences in people with npd. This time I was able to enjoy myself, keep busy and not think too much about why, I finally understand it isnt me, I understand his narcissism, after immersing myself for past 10 years, it still hurts though, I hope someday, the hurt will go away. 2. There are times I just want to say enough! I told him that since he wouldnt go for help, he had to leave. Have we had good times? He did not give me any support. But I just feel like Im still the one doing all the work. We would have conversations and he would tell me that I need a spanking, o no. 5 Stay calm when they try to upset you. Its not fair to her. In Kim & Steves ebook Back From The Looking Glass there are several examples of how to accomplish this. He wont make her happy she will be sad feel unloved and insecure with such a guy. If they find someone else who thrives on this, they'll fall in love quickly. Ive also had to realize that I am a classic co-dependent and always thinking we can somehow get back to the way things wereor at least how I fantasize they were. If I dont look at him in his eyes he says it is rude. I still love this man. Can a Narcissist Change for Love? - Marriage 21) You watched me doing side work to meet ends meat, while asking me for more money and letting me pay for 90% of the groceries and other things. Our ongoing battle has been over his ex-wife. At this point, I think it may be best (for me, likely him too) to stay away and do nothing or resolve the legal aspect. He also said we dont have kids, theres no reason to stay together. ANYTIME I complain about anything there is ABSOLUTELY no sympathetic response from him. It took me awhile to recover but the next time he begin, I immediately put him in his place and each time he tried to come out, I put him in his place again. Narcissists Are Not Accountable | Psychology Today Ive heared my whole life that she is so wonderful. It sounds like you have high expectations (perceived) from your partner. When you've finally had enough of their antics and hold a narcissist accountable for their actions, they will fly into a rage to make you back off and distract from your accusations. So hard to get out of my marriage for many reasons. He has been paying for his share of the utilities so that I give him credit for but everything else is pretty much up to me. Why? Even though he is so full of himself that he made the entire process as miserable as possible for himself and me. HE keeps pushing it out and starting to fight and I really need to know what we are doing, IE what my budget will be. He told me yesterday that he was changing phone carriers because the sales agent hung up the phone on him and he thought that was rude. Perhaps your local mental health team? It really helps!! If so, what was his incentive? Because he was ashamed of his failure it was easy for him to be quiet because really he didnt know what to say anyway. They are experts at playing with feelings and getting what they want, and you are the one who pays while you self-esteem continues to diminish. That is why YOU don't confront them alone be it male or female, you must be clever. Ongoing hostile silence that never ends. Where are you now? Fortunately, my 13 year old can see most of his BS, but the 10 and 9 year old boys can not. Then, after he left, I was right out of my mind, and nasty, until I started getting some help. He was in the habit of driving completely drunk. This can be a sudden outburst of anger or passive aggression. In the mean time, I date other men on a non-sexual basis but for some reason, my heart is drawn to my NPD friend. Forget Counselling..these people are great liars..I got Kims books..they do work. A lot of friends think he is amazing although a lot of friends see through him now. Unbelievable. Hi Ann, I certainly agree with Kim. And at times it does work. I had terrible abandonment issues from my childhood and bereavements and his scared child behaviour never helped. So stop stalking them on social media or asking mutual friends about them. Understanding Narcissism, by Elizabeth Shaw. I saw that and I used that knowledge to my advantage. Maybe if i had not had all the losses and children and could have spent my life concentrating on working on him there could have been hope but i think it is unlikely. Hi Lady Jane, you may want that sure but selfish people arent prone to listening! So frustrated in my 24 years of marriage! Our entire marriage he has NEVER taken responsibilty for anything. She told me when I was in high school that she picked me to take care of all the family members. How to Disarm a Narcissist (and Make Them a Bit More Tolerable) How to Stay with a Narcissist - Psych Central This had 2 effects. He uses people big time to get what he wants out of life. My friend (who once was my lover) always blames me when we fight and then breaks it off for awhile. We had an event October 12th to attend together, and I said we will keep this date, but that if things dont improve, that this will have to be goodbye. Then the row would be about him trying to leave not about the original subject which was over and done with already. Do Narcissists Like To Be Held Accountable? This woman was a serial liar who could turn on the tears at will and present herself as a very convincing victim. Was left for me is to accept the real him and stop falling for the fantasy of who I would like him to be. No matter how soul destroying this type of relationship can be, your experience of this disorder being incurable is not ours and the DSM has also recently been updated to change their position on this. Clever eh. Remember its ok to be alone and in these cases its better to be alone. them, promoting a sturdy stance for (empathically) holding the narcissist accountable. and yet, he BLAMES ME and texted me just the other day about how hurt and angry he is. I did and you talked to her on her birthday and I was so glad you made her feel loved. Whenever we are growing closer, he will try and start a fight about nothing, just to give himself permission to get away and blaming me for it. I was thinking and came up with. Looking back on a long-term relationship with a Narcissistic bf, I see I had big delusions about us both For a year we worked hard using Kims materials- which worked really well- to the point where I no longer felt weak or controlled, and my partner altered behavior beyond what Id ever (EVER) thought possible! What (they) choose to believe is irrelevant. I am hesistant as his actions around the birth of our boy showed him to be absent and immature with a failure to own his own behaviour. We are going to change this? Thankfully I know that he didnt reject me because of who I am but discarded me because of who he is! Keeping rapport at the same time as setting boundaries is tough but a balancing act that helps a person become a better leader for sure! Thanks Kim I understand you dont have alot of info to work with. I feel I did a very good job of using the above techniques the second I realized I had a narcissist on my hands. Yes I have been working at making our home and relationship safe and secure thanks to the information that you provide and I can see a definite change in my husband. I have just stood by and finally let it all happen to him. The story above contains the prescription for striking fear in a narcissist by holding up the shining mirror of truth. For all this time I have been working on myself, attending classes through the church (designed for couples, but they are letting me go by myself)and I (unlike him) remember the good timeshe COULD be really, really sweetand my soul still loves him (its the only way I know how to describe it as it takes me out of the very human/ego part of me that is pissed as hell at the childish, immoral behavior)..it also lets me not put the blame on myself (which I bought into, and still do some days, like today). Dealing with the trauma resulting from a abusive relationship is really hard to do. Before he comes begging her back! That has caused me to understand that God loves my friend too. I dont want my children to marry a person like him. Everything is for him. There is no one answer to this question, as the best way to hold a narcissist accountable will vary depending on the situation and the severity of the narcissist's behavior. Emotionally it would have felt to me like defeat I couldnt make myself go that road I was shunned enough. The link is as follows: http://www.mental-health-matters.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=167. I think the marriage is dead. My husband asked for a divorce November 2012 and we are in the process. Its going to cost him a whole lot more when he moves out and has to pay someone to live somewhere else. Do I just let go of this since it is the past? I tried to help someone that I thought I cared about every day for a year and in the end, I ended up trying to hold on to her to the point where she consciously decided she would blatantly lie to the police about any contact, even coincidental, which resulted in me being arrested for STALKING her even though my contacts with her consisted of 5 phone calls none of which consisted of anything but the question why? Have much to learn! When I noticed them missing and asked you, you lied at first and then came to me later to tell me what you did. He makes real good money but tells me he works his ass off for me because I quit my job and hurt us. I dont want to possess him or be obsessed with him. We made the agreement that we would split the payment and insurance in the meantime so you had a car to drive. 10 Signs of Narcissism - Health The problem is that with the upcoming deployment time is very limited and decisions have to be made. Yet he is exhausted because of them. Its okay, he doesnt have to believe it. Good luck everyone. His response is that he does not need to tell us whether or not he has moved on, while hurting the ones that love him because not care that he who calls us his family, is feeling this change in him, and yet he refuses to explain. Not throwing it in his face but letting him know that he is not the only person in my life. For years I thought eventually hed come back into my life. I know that I need to be patient and quiet.. Anyway the aderall med increased and over time he was prescribed a insanely large dose. He doesnt want to decide because then he has to be accountable I know that much. Forever taking and never giving. Hide nothing and do the best with what you have, but never, NEVER, accept the responsibility for your Nar behaviors. However if they perceive that they do not need you to feel secure and happy you had better find a way to get out quickly because they have no incentive to check their behaviour. Sometimes, the best way to hold a narcissist accountable is to take the proverbial bull by the horns and directly, and (unwaveringly) address their behavior. He mixes prescription meds and alcohol and is a walking time bomb. Your indifference is their kryptonite. You are correct that there is no point in arguing but that does not mean he will never understand it was wrong. how do I get over the pride and resentment I have? Even my grown sons do not understand what I nightmare I went through twice. Absolute hell. I know that something good will come out of this for everyone. There was no mention of when we could see each other and I guess I had to accept it But noooo I didnt instead I confronted my n by saying that my friends have noticed how sad and depressed I am and certain friends were concerned about me. 3. For a woman in relationship with a narcissistic man, does it make any sense to use sex to hold him accountable? Ive learned a lot from this website, emails and posts. How to hold a Narcissist accountable.Holding a Narcissist I constantly remind myself of this. If you respect yourself enough to stand up for your own interests this will earn others respect too. The love-bombing stage is over. There doesnt seem to be anything else I CAN do. Its almost two years later, we are separate under the same roof until I can move out. Do you have availability to a womens shelter or crisis hot line? 9 Signs A Narcissist Is Finished With You - Live Bold and Bloom I have no idea what goes on there and he has take. Doing so leads them to become frustrated or angry. Please consider: Narcissistic people hate it when anyone tries to hold them accountable and so attempting to make them admit their shortcomings or mistakes will only break rapport. Trust will start being built when your partner begins to see that you are capable of protecting your own interests and that you are not scared of doing what you need to do to stand up for yourself calmly and with deliberation without abandoning them or using emotional manipulation to try and get your way. If they owe you money, hire a debt collector (if you need to) and step away from the adversarial role and let someone else do the dirty work. Im here to look for tools, connect with people with common problems, AND offer my unique story as well. Very spiritual, as well. I now know there is no fixing or holding them accountable short of having them arrested if there is criminal behavior. So conclusion I dont think its wise to ask them would they feel more comfortable getting help from somebody else to help with the situation as they see this as a threat and if they are truly narcissistic they dont think they need help with anything. Many rapes occur repeatedly and by family members and even if exposed the victim is not believed. I have the same questions as TANYA and also wonder where to start, do i say I love you and forgive you and just start? Hi DA, Sorry this post has been so popular I havent had time to respond to everyone. Slavery works like that; not freedom. Finally I knew I couldnt live like that and I had to leave. And yet, Id give anything to turn back the hands of time and find a way to work through thisbelieving in my heart that we could both emerge more whole and healed and have a wonderful life! I am becoming the woman I was when we met the one he hated. along with the narcissist's makeup - helps us to bypass obstacles when dealing with. Not sure if hes a narcissist but one thing I do know is he is super nice to everyone else unless they piss him off or what he perceives to be an attack on him from someone usually family/me and he lets strangers/co-workers walk all over him. I am all ears for any suggestions, because right now its hard to sayits o.k. From that second I met her I wanted her. I am better off without him. I couldnt live the lie and we divorced. As many people have pointed out here, I try to reason with someone who seems to have the emotional and rational capability of an eight year old. He never leaves them unattended and puts so much pressure on them not to want to see me. I sit here feeling alone, empty, worn outas usual, he was in his funk, I was invisible most of the time to him, his excuse is his job issues(once again). Everything is my fault. Ultimately, narcissism cannot be cured only managed. Some days I am so glad that he is gone I could scream others days I really miss his presence not him. Breaking Up With A Narcissist: How To Do It & What To Expect A week before my birthday Im told that hes going away with his daughter to see his brother in Singapore and my birthday would be missed. He was an illusion all along. Another common way for a narcissist's lack of accountability in relationships is to withhold from you as a form of punishment. I mean for me to feel the kind of trust for him and love from him that a woman ought for someone she is having sex with wow, that would be gigantic. I am so sorry to hear this Aspen, This is why we put so much stress on you being calm and very careful in how you approach the police. Life is hard enough without having to adapt yourself to twisted ways of relating to someone in order to have any semblance of a relationship. You need to send this to his doctor and also CC someone else as a witness. 5. But recently it has about chewed me up and spit me out. 30 years later and the situation is only different in that I never set boundaries with her. What percentage of females. I have tried many times for the sake of my children. I do sometimes text my husband if I need to ask something or tel him something he may or may not freak about. When dealing with the childlike behavior and consequences another good place for practical steps is love and logic. We keep educating ourselves to belong to something, to excel, to achieve, to alienate all those in our own selfish path. And thanks Kim for this site and your work. To say that it is difficult is an understatement but now that I have healed a little and am much stronger, I simply dont take his rubbish. You Hold Them Accountable. But really, I am just angry and hurt. After a vew weeks he hit the wall just next to my head. I feel it is OK to set the boundry that he needs to decide what he wants or I will have to make decisions on my Own. God bless you all. I have set up a separate account for our bills, what do you think we can do" (this to a spendthrift partner) You Never Beat The Narcissist But once you go there you have lost haven't you? I do love him. As Kym and others have said living with someone with NPD is at best very difficult and at worst totally impossible. When two month later you parents decided they wanted to stay where they were, and we had to get a roommate to be able to cover the rent, you blamed me for having a stranger living in our home. Do these people actually know what they are doing? I wonder if there are any young men out there who have made a relationship work with a NPD young lady I feel with love and support from friends and family there must be a chance, I would appreciate any advice like most people who deal with this personality type as a mother I have been to hell and back, as well as most advice saying basically its my fault shes like this. Here's why a narcissist may cry when someone dies: Attention - to shift the spotlight of the whole event onto them and claim as much of the focus as possible. It is natural for narcissistic people to care for the things that they consider worthy, particularly when given a platform to do so. There is good in him. Why are we attracted to this type? I told him what I did and said it was better that way, that way we can avoid him being the middle man since I do all the banking anyways and it wouldnt cause a problem for him or us in the future with an argument over the ph cause of a misunderstanding and he got soooo mad telling me again how I dont know how hard some of his days are blah blah and thats when I said, I am NOT your punching bagyou wanna rag on someonerag on the person who first called you at a bad time NOT me. So I guess I would ask you to ask yourself if you are grieving or co-dependent(co-dependence effects most of our relationships). We have 2 children together and this time has been very difficult. In my marriage, I only said something when I was pushed to the wall and was accused of being the one at fault because he was perfectly happy in the marriage. Like I said, I have been firm with establishing boundaries for myself in a calm and non-confrontational but stern manner, but he continues to violate them and refuses to speak to me. Hes a gigolo too, pretty sure of it.I need him out of here and dont know how to be more blunt. The reason i fall for these men? Looking back we both use each other for opposite reasons. I need to know how to respond or do I respond? When I downloaded the book I had hope. I collected me from work, he cooked for me, he gave me massages and we enjoyed many interests together. All of the blaming, name-calling, lying, deflecting, financial abuse is worse. He is also a huge sex addict and turns out he had a secret apt. Says I am a know it all and have too many opinions.He does revenge for things I didnt try to do. This is called domestic violence. Or is cutting off sex simply the same as threatening to leave him? Unfortunately he died 2 years ago. Really tough though. This is certainly difficult. I think it is wise that you talk to him but also be prepared. She can do so much better and deserves so much better. Be the happy person you were meant to be and fear nothing! Dear Kim Avery, I am so sorry for what you are going thru.. it breaks my heart! i cant see them. signs of Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Holding a Narcissist Accountable - TheNCMarriage.com. Non sexual but emotional. What i do is speak to the child in him at that point. I do not need permission to talk to another adult about concerns that I have that affect my families well being. Cause and effect. This is an interesting topic. Narcissists love a good fight and not because they are any good at arguing but they know how to push your buttons. He has admitted what he was doing and also admitted what he feels. Kim, I havent yet bought your book Looking Glass. I cannot imagine doing such things to our children. Did he just not bond with me and I did with him and that is why this seems harder? He owes me money and keeps asking for more. Weve been together 7 years. It has been a terribly difficult 3 years, but understanding I had to stop being the victim & use techniques Ive learned through you and others, has helped. Its all straight from the heart and tells it like it really is. And I just been letting get away with these destructive things. Like a fool I tried to withdraw the charges but the state took over and would not allow it. We had a huge fight the other night have not really spoken in 3 days. When Matt has consequences, he uses the boys against me. Everything that has been stated here is exactly what Ive been through. 6 Treatment might include cognitive behavioral therapy, or medicine to help reduce mood. 3. Narcissists can only play the game they do if the people around them allow themselves to be deceived by their lies. I also take a supplement called laminine (amino acids & FGF) that helps regulate my hormones and neurotransmitters which get out of whack with the roller coaster ride of living with a narcissist and it helps them as well with theses issues eggoflife.com/jseals. Which I did. But I still miss him so am venerable and just hope I get stronger. He always states he should have been a lawyer because he knows how to argue/defendHe says this even in re to issues at work, he uses that statement whenever hes feeling like things arent going his way. He does have a good side, but I am beginning to wonder which is the real him. Despite the difficulties of this life, I love my husband and do not want to leave him. I just didnt take his bait and didnt talk about the negative thing he was trying to focus on about me. How To Break Up With Someone Toxic/Narcissistic Safely - And Never Look I have survived and will be fine, regardless if he gets better or not! I said that I would speak for him and get the whole world off his back and all he had to do was be quiet and useful and learn what it was like at home with him not around. No amount of behavioural changes will alter that brain function however if the N person needs you in their life I think you will be able to make the relationship work by managing the impact of their cognitive disability on your self. Its no suprise they hide from their toxic shame. Why do feel the need to write and give him this or, of the sort, letter? I am committed to make my marriage work! After more and more learning and healing, the less I want to give intimacy of any kind to narcissists in the future, because it will never be an equal relationship Kims comment about pulling on the thread [of ones own] superiority really struck a chord- one of the main reasons for staying (besides much love) was, in retrospect, to feel like his hero- which meant feeling a little morally superior to him! He started his job about 6 months ago, since then, he has changed the way things were previously done by pointing out to those in charge how things were un-safehe told me his co workers call him health and safety for a nick namehe doesnt realise how I soooo get the name they have given him and I am afraid he has said too much at work. Do you think thats possible? Please dont ever stop! I love him, I love my daughter and need to protect her, and I know there is a good man in therebut as long as he sits on both sides of the fence, we will continue to long for the real family that he is not sure he wants to be. Booyah! I think mine married me thinking hed improve his station in life (although he said I could quit working before we were married) and was vastly disappointed at my low earnings after marriage and soon after my parents hints of creating a trust so that their money could not go to him, he left. 5 Ways To Disarm a Narcissist And Save Your Sanity - Divorced Moms 2 Flaunt how happy you are without them. Then what if they break the promise? Sep 3 I am happy and I have money in my name in caseI am left behind. I would not let him believe he could get away with it with me. They have forgiven you time and time again. Does this include rape? He even told the marriage counselor he couldnt promise (an affair) wouldnt happen again! He is truly an emotional invalid with little ability to connect. Many of them have legal advocates that help you with your situation. Hey Hazel You really need to work through the 10 Steps to Overcome Codependence and The Love Safety Net Workbook. I believe that the core problem is not the differences in living conditions that we all struggle to agree on and adhere to, but the underlying cognitive inabilities and resulting lack of empathy that gives rise to such a consistent lack of regard for another person. 18) When I got a fever blister on my lip, because I had been so beyond stressed, you told me that women get it from sucking to much . This guy is gone, not one word said to me in 1 1/2 years after he ended it and told me he wanted to get rid of me for a long time., The things youre teaching I could apply if there was ever any other relationship, but, they seem extremely difficult since its such a strong tendency to want to point out their behavior and to explain mine. As for your car I would make a statement to the police and say it is necessary they investigate this for your insurance claim. But in my house they are the constant fare. You then threw in my face later Well I had to borrow the money from you so I could buy YOU and YOUR kids Christmas presents. I feel trapped! He actually even said,or yelled, the whole world is wrong there is nothing wrong with me. He has made threats to kill his biological daughter and her family.